member responses and conversations - general

bluebird

Major Contributor
I was recently half-listening to a discussion on BBC Radio when I heard its contributors discussing the man Jesus and how the west often portrays the guy as having had light coloured skin and blue eyes.

Yes of course they're only representations but how unrealistic are they when it's obvious - I suggest - that his skin, hair and eye colors would be closer to those of the people living in the region he was born into and especially to those of his parents?

Add all that to many unprovable stories and myths and we end up with a hopelessly inaccurate impression of the guy.
Unfortunately that's just racism at work (in this particular example, I mean). :(
 

mac

Administrator
Unfortunately that's just racism at work (in this particular example, I mean). :(
I'm assuming you're meaning the skin color matter? I'm more forgiving, bb. People are fallible and the ones who created the images may not have acted deliberately in a racist fashion - although I concede they MIGHT. ;)

In my view it's not important how any individual pictures Jesus in her mind but it is important when others are likely be influenced by an image they're exposed to or if they're deliberately taught something that's patently absurd. Children are most obviously at risk of being misled but adults should have the nouse to sort it for themselves.
 

bluebird

Major Contributor
Yes, I mean the skin color. Maybe initially Jesus was portrayed as white by priests, Christian book publishers, etc., in western countries because it was known or at least assumed that some white people in the US, Canada, Europe, etc., wouldn't be able to accept a more accurate portrayal due to ingrained racism....I know that some Christian fundamentalists continue to portray Jesus as a white guy because of their racism. I'm sure there are some people who aren't deliberately racist about it, but c'mon -- how could anyone with even a modicum of intelligence really believe that Jesus, who according to all accounts was Middle Eastern (at least insofar as his humanity), could possibly have pale skin, blue eyes, and Caucasian features? Maybe children could believe it, but any adult who does is either unintelligent or disingenuous.
 

mac

Administrator
Maybe children could believe it, but any adult who does is either unintelligent or disingenuous.
no argument there, bb

It would be illuminating to hear what folk might say if approached but how many would be honest?
 

bluebird

Major Contributor
no argument there, bb

It would be illuminating to hear what folk might say if approached but how many would be honest?

Good point. Even people who aren't truly racist often have some ingrained bias of which they may be unaware -- the same can be said of sexist or homophobic thinking. And even when that isn't the case, sometimes language can contain bias even when the speaker does not intend for it to be so....Just as an example -- as a child, part of the lexicon among my peers and I if we felt we had been in some way cheated was to say we'd been "gypped", which I now know is a derogatory term about the supposed behavior of Roma people (gypsies), a way to say they steal/cheat, but as a child I had no idea the word had anything to do with gypsies. As a non-racist adult, however, I haven't used that word since I found out its origin/meaning.
 

mac

Administrator
Is there any wonder that trans-dimensional communication (for those who accept such a notion) is so difficult when we humans have such difficulty at times just within our own dimension?
 

mac

Administrator
"Seth mentioned in “The Unknown Reality” that even trees have dreams."

I haven't read the above compilation so there may be additional material explaining what Seth means but that bald statement leaves me thinking "What a crock!" Without context many statements may sound ludicrous, of course.

I would guess most of us humans experience dreams in a similar way albeit we each experience our own in total isolation and there's no knowing how others experience dreams - other than from what they tell us about them. Even that has to be based on how much they can recall of the ones they have. Have you ever wondered how many of your dreams you may, or may not, remember?

As for trees having dreams my thought is that if they do dream then the form of such dreams is likely to be somewhat different from our own. That might be different to such a degree one might question whether it's dreaming at all the way we understand and define it.

Applying 'the Silver Birch test' to the notion of trees having dreams, however, leaves none of it appealing to my reason. Even more than I did before I now reject any purported guidance from any purported spirit source when his ideas don't meet my adopted, simple test.

There used to be a time where I would try to understand what something odd might have been meant, a time where I'd try not to be dismissive of others' ideas and notions but not any more.
 
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bluebird

Major Contributor
"Seth mentioned in “The Unknown Reality” that even trees have dreams."

I haven't read the above compilation so there may be additional material explaining what Seth means but that bald statement leaves me thinking "What a crock!" Without context many statements may sound ludicrous, of course.

I would guess most of us humans experience dreams in a similar way albeit we each experience our own in total isolation and there's no knowing how others experience dreams - other than from what they tell us about them. Even that has to be based on how much they can recall of the ones they have. Have you ever wondered how many of your dreams you may, or may not, remember?

As for trees having dreams my thought is that if they do dream then the form of such dreams is likely to be somewhat different from our own. That might be different to such a degree one might question whether it's dreaming at all the way we understand and define it.

Applying 'the Silver Birch test' to the notion of trees having dreams, however, leaves none of it appealing to my reason. Even more than I did before I now reject any purported guidance from any purported spirit source when his ideas don't meet my adopted, simple test.

There used to be a time where I would try to understand what something odd might have been meant, a time where I'd try not to be dismissive of others' ideas and notions but not any more.

I generally agree with you on the "trees have dreams" idea. The only thing I can think of that even might be what was meant is that trees do have cycles of activity and cycles of rest, and also that plants can communicate with each other in a rudimentary way, particularly trees which share a root system. So maybe if some trees are in a rest cycle while others are in an active cycle, if the resting trees are sort of aware of the activity of the active trees, that awareness might be considered dreaming?

Just thinking out loud, the idea is by no means carved in stone for me -- it's just the only thing I can think of which is even sort of like trees dreaming.
 

mac

Administrator
I generally agree with you on the "trees have dreams" idea. The only thing I can think of that even might be what was meant is that trees do have cycles of activity and cycles of rest, and also that plants can communicate with each other in a rudimentary way, particularly trees which share a root system. So maybe if some trees are in a rest cycle while others are in an active cycle, if the resting trees are sort of aware of the activity of the active trees, that awareness might be considered dreaming?

Just thinking out loud, the idea is by no means carved in stone for me -- it's just the only thing I can think of which is even sort of like trees dreaming.

I get your way of thinking, bb, but all that would be 'making things fit'. I've got the book in my desktop trash can and I suppose I might hunt out the relevant section but I don't see much point as neither of us is likely to be influenced by anything Seth said anyway! lol :D

Interestingly, or probably not for most, is the way the overall subject was addressed in Julie Gale's compilation of channeled guidance from her guide detailed in 'Soul Trek'. In it her communicator speaks about the nature of experiences we have as our 'real' selves, our spirit selves, and in that section he speaks about experience living as less progressed entities, even down to forms rather more difficult to accept for many - those of inanimate objects.

I have embraced in general background acknowledgement much of what I learned in that book while at the same time declaring I simply do not have the intellectual capacity to fully process certain ideas and guidance. Deep inside me, however, I do feel the principles communicated may well be fundamentally sound but presenting them to individuals as dumb as I am - or even to those reasonably assumed to be massively more spiritually progressed - may be a step farther than is practical.

I do wonder if even those we may look up to as guides in various matters are in actuality as far advanced as we believe. I've often said that those 'over there' who we are able to reach have not made such advanced spiritual progress that they have moved beyond the point where mortals can still reach them.

To support that last notion I think of my personal favorite Silver Birch who (as best I can recall) had to use 'step-down' entities as a way to match his own highly advanced spiritual 'vibrations' more closely to those of his receiver, Maurice Barbanell in this world. (like electronic impedance matching of source and output to obtain the best power transfer)

He told how he had chosen this highly sceptical 'non-believer' many years before and then learned over decades how best to control Barbanell and then utilise his mental capacity in order that SB could communicate his own words effectively and with minimal coloration from the mind/brain/psyche of 'his instrument', as he referred to Barbanell.

Rightly or wrongly it leaves me doubting that others are actually more adept than master Silver Birch at controlling their own 'instruments' here in this world to convey guidance about life 'over there' and also to convey guidance about matters spiritual to us dumbos 'over here' in this physical world.
 
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bluebird

Major Contributor
mac,

I agree that what I suggested would be "making things fit", lol -- "trees dreaming" isn't a concept in which I really believe, I just found it interesting to consider as a kind of thought experiment.

As to the rest of what you've said, I haven't read much in terms of spiritual entities advising living people -- as you know, I am not convinced that such entities actually even exist (nor am I convinced that they do not -- as with many things in this area, I remain agnostic). If they do exist, however, I can certainly see how it might be difficult for them to communicate advanced spiritual ideas via less advanced "translators", as it were.
 
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