1. Afterlife Forums is an online, interactive community designed to give seekers direct access to prominent researchers, to afterlife literature, and to one another in order to foster both spiritual growth and public interest in life after death.
    Dismiss Notice

Saints as Spiritual Guides

Discussion in 'Spiritual Growth & Development' started by JCM, Oct 27, 2017.

  1. JCM

    JCM New Member

    My cradle belief system is Roman Catholic. One of Catholicism's strongest appeals for me is the veneration of saints. I view a number of such saints, particularly those about whom much is known based on their writings and well-documented biographies, to be sources of inspiration and comfort. I feel particularly "close" to a well-known French saint from the 19th century. Indeed, I have had numerous inexplicable "coincidences" that I can only attribute to her intervention. I wonder if others, perhaps those raised in a similar tradition, have insights to share on the role of great spiritual figures on our own ongoing journeys on earth.
     
  2. jimrich

    jimrich Active Member

    JCM, since I was not raised in any particular religious tradition other than general Christianity, but have done a lot of work in psychology, I see the veneration of saints as a kind of role modeling. Over the years, I've found a lot of good "role models" to revere and follow such as Meister Eckhart, Ramana Maharshi (of India), Eckhart Tolle and a lot of current teachers/spokes-persons in philosophy and spirituality who are not yet deemed to be Saints. Now that I am 80 y.o., I find that I can and need to be my own role-model as well as anyone or anything outside of me. IMO, the phrase, "Let your conscience be your guide" is good enough and covers a lot of behavior and beliefs but I still respect and honor the teachings and modeling of Saints and others.
    When you say, "....I can only attribute to her intervention.", do you mean that she comes to you (in spirit) to offer assistance or help in the same way a Dis-incarnate relative or spouse can appear to someone?
    I currently believe, but cannot prove, that those in Heaven or the afterlife (Jesus, Mother Mary, god, my late wife, etc.) can and do appear to us Incarnates in various forms to help us. IM current O, the greatest spiritual figure is our own inner/higher Self or Being, followed by whatever outer spiritual figure we chose to venerate. "The kingdom of heaven is within you." ~ Jesus Christ
     
  3. bluebird

    bluebird Well-Known Member

    JCM,

    I was raised Catholic as well, though in our particular church not much was made of the saints, other than viewing them as particularly good and spiritual people. So in my upbringing, there wasn't much in the way of veneration of the saints, though I did always feel a particular fondness towards St. Francis, as I love animals.

    That said -- it's quite possible that some of the people viewed as saints in Catholicism truly were spiritually enlightened people, and while I don't really believe in praying to them as such, I can see where one might feel close to a particular saint, and I don't see any problem in sort of talking to a saint (which I suppose could be viewed as a kind of prayer). Basically, I do kind of view some of them as spiritual figures.
     
  4. JCM

    JCM New Member

    Thanks jimrich and bluebird, By "intervention", I mean that I have noted "coincidences" that encourage me to hope that such enlightened beings are aware of us, particularly when we come to love them based on our readings and just general interest in them. I suppose my, somewhat unspecific query, is whether those we did not know personally can become as important our own deceased friends and relatives in our spiritual development.

    I have also wondered, if in the afterlife or Heaven, we stay with "our own kind," meaning are people from the same epoch or geographical area reconstituted as a society or do people from vastly different eras and places come together?

    On a semi-serious note, would people in the afterlife be anxious to meet those they have heard so much about: "where is George Washington?" Or does that type of earthly celebrity not transcend the veil. But I think I would still like to hang out with 19th century folks and "meet" Lincoln and Emily Dickinson! But I think those two--highly developed spirits if there ever were any--would be at a very high plane indeed.
     
  5. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    Three great questions! Here are answers based upon what we are told by those that we used to think were dead:

    1) We all have one primary spirit guide who helped to plan our lifetime and then guides us through living our life-plan. The designation "saint" is a human one. There is no evidence that it has any function in the afterlife beyond giving the dead a way to connect with us by sometimes presenting themselves as familiar saints to people who expect to see saints. There, what people focus on is spiritual growth; and many, many people who were never remarked when they were on earth can be in truth very advanced beings indeed. JCM, Catholicism is a religion. Every religion is man-made, and in truth it has nothing to do with the genuine reality or the genuine Mind of which we all are part and which is all that exists.

    2) There is no post-death segregation of the sort that you imagine. We all have lived many lifetimes, and we have very many eternal friends who may have shared other lifetimes with us - we have lots of beloved people to enjoy that we do not now remember at all because of the amnesia that we accept as part of the deal when we come to earth. Oh, the joyous reunions that we all have in store! BUT there are indeed places where people gather to enjoy replicating earth-epochs. You might play for a while in Old West Town, or 1950s Bobby-Soxers Town, or in just about any other epoch that ever has existed. There is literally no limit to the fun to be had!

    3) As to your third question, according to my own primary guide - who was Thomas Jefferson in his penultimate lifetime - people are forever searching him out to ask questions and talk about his TJ lifetime, and he doesn't seem to be happy about that. He appears now in the persona of his last earth-lifetime, as a man named John who lived in Wales - according to Susanne Wilson, he looks something like Clive Owen - and he insists to us that being TJ was not even his most important lifetime. So I'll bet that Abraham Lincoln, too, is pretty much "over" having been Abraham Lincoln. On the other hand, many 20th-century entertainers still entertain there; in particular, just about everyone seems to have seen Elvis perform at least once!
     
  6. JCM

    JCM New Member

    Thank you for your insightful feedback!
     
  7. genewardsmith

    genewardsmith New Member

    I don't think we can assume all of us have had lots of past lives. As for Jefferson, here's another source which seems to have him still up there being Jefferson:



     
  8. genewardsmith

    genewardsmith New Member

  9. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    Thanks for posting this! It was listening to this Leslie Flint recording that finally convinced Susanne Wilson and me that we were in fact dealing with the entity that had been Thomas Jefferson. When he recorded this, he was guiding a 14-year-old girl and he must have been bored out of his (considerable) mind. He speaks here EXACTLY as he speaks to Susanne - as she says, his personality is unmistakable. And his mission for my lifetime is to assist in elevating the consciousness of the planet, so there is no wonder that during my pre-adult period he might have taken whatever opportunity he could find to get started. He had to come through here as TJ, because some guy from Wales would not have gotten the attention that he could get in his more famous persona. But he shows the same lack of interest in his TJ career as the Thomas that Susanne and I know now, the same determination to teach peace on earth, and in literally dozens of ways he is the exact same entity that Susanne and I know now.

    For me, to be frank, the most amazing thing was that at the instant that I began to listen to this recording I RECOGNIZED HIS VOICE! I was a young male protege of his when he was old, and this is precisely how he sounded in his eighties. Listening to this recording always brings that lifetime right back to me.
     
  10. genewardsmith

    genewardsmith New Member

    That's interesting about the voice. He says he was considered a "plain spoken man" by those who knew him, which suggests to me that his style in writing was not the same as his style in speech. In any case, the voice is quite distinctive.

    As for the Edgar Cayce version of Jefferson, I'm dubious about that since one person thought that postulating this young man was Jefferson was the thing, in all the Cayce readings, he found the most doubtful!

    I was thinking of adding scenarios where both Wilson and Flint got it right, but I see you were way ahead of me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2017
  11. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    I have been taught by my children not to click links because I have on occasion imported viruses, so I have not clicked the link above; but in fact, Cayce was wrong. Thomas tells us that his last incarnation was as an average man named John in Wales; he took it to bring himself "back into balance" after his Jefferson lifetime. It seems to have begun in the mid-19th century and ended early in the 20th.

    Yes, TJ's voice was quite distinctive! First hearing it again was the most astonishing moment of my life. It is amazing, too, that he could so accurately replicate his voice in that lifetime when to do it he had to modify an ectoplasm voicebox on Leslie Flint's shoulder! One of the things that I look forward to finding out once I graduate is how the heck the dead are able to do that so well ;-)!
     
  12. genewardsmith

    genewardsmith New Member

    Speaking of founding fathers, Tymn mentions somewhere that he had heard that the idea of rappings as a means of communication was dreamed up by Swedenborg and Franklin. If so, they initiated modern spiritualism. Does anyone know what Tymn's source for this might be?
     
  13. bluebird

    bluebird Well-Known Member

    I suppose it's possible that such enlightened beings, if they exist, can be or become aware of specific individuals on earth, and become close to us. I certainly would never say it can't possibly be so, since there's really no way for me to know. Regardless -- if you feel that sort of closeness and find that it helps you, that's not a bad thing. :)

    As far as the afterlife -- I don't know if one exists, but if it does then I would think that you can hang out with whomever you choose, provided they choose to hang out with you. I don't see why such artificial separators as geography or time should factor in to it. As to whether we can meet and interact with famous people once we die, I really don't know -- it would be nice to be able to interact with specific people for whom we have a fondness or affinity, though.
     

Share This Page