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making things fit?

Discussion in 'Spiritual Growth & Development' started by mac, Oct 1, 2018.


Do you feel the young woman DID make a choice at some point?

  1. no - it was just misfortune

  2. yes - it was likely planned before her incarnation

  3. yes - it was brought about after she began her life here

  4. no - her chosen exit as a youngster was for other reasons

  1. mac

    mac Staff Member

    Here on my side of the big pond there's been an inquest into the death of a young woman. She died because of her long-standing and extreme sesame seed allergy after buying a prepared sandwich. She'd checked the label on the sandwich which complied with regulations and showed no sesame ingredient. She died in the arms of her dad even though he'd tried to save her using the two 'epi-pens' she always carried for emergencies. Needles likely weren't long enough to reach muscle tissue the inquest found.

    It's easy to make things fit by saying her death was something she'd planned before inacarnation as a wake-up call for better labeling in the UK; maybe it was. But maybe I'd be putting an undeserved gloss on a desperately tragic and traumatic, totally avoidable, untimely death.

    What, though, if it WERE a planned outcome? Might it have always been the planned outcome, something orchestrated by our friends unseen to result in her death when she was 20 15 years old? (age edited - my mistake)

    Or might it have been a changed plan for the outcome of her life, something cobbled together by these unseen entities? A previously-unplanned, 'exit point' concocted by her and orchestrated by her helpers in response to her concerns about the potential dangers to others. Something she saw after she began her life in this world, a sacrifice that others might be protected?

    Or was it just an unplanned, accidental, tragic end to a life that had actually been intended to last longer and achieve more?

    Take a look at the poll questions and vote please.

    Then maybe you'd like to give us your thoughts about my ideas or add your own thoughts?
  2. bluebird

    bluebird Regular Contributor

    Assuming there is an afterlife/beforelife, in my opinion we do not choose all of the events of our lives, even all of the major ones, including death. Perhaps we don't choose any of it. I acknowledge that it is possible that she chose her death, but given the pain it must be causing her loved ones, I doubt it. In my opinion it is a sad, unplanned tragedy.
    Kurt likes this.
  3. mac

    mac Staff Member

    I used to feel similar, bb, but now I harbor doubts and think it's at least a possibility - even if it's a long shot.
    Kurt likes this.
  4. bluebird

    bluebird Regular Contributor

    Could be a possibility, I agree. I just know, deep in my soul, that neither my husband nor I chose for him to die when he did. Because of that, I know that these things aren't always done by choice. That doesn't mean that sometimes they aren't, though, if there is a "beforelife" in which we can make such decisions.

    For me, that knowledge would not bring any peace, it would only make me feel worse. Perhaps for that young woman's family it would also make them feel worse if they knew that it was her choice, or perhaps it would help bring them some peace. I suppose that depends on the person/people.
    Kurt likes this.
  5. ForeverAutumn

    ForeverAutumn New Member

    This is a tricky one. I think any of the first three options might be true. However, I've gone with "likely planned before her incarnation" for the following reasons.

    I think it highly likely that we survive our physical deaths and continue to exist in non-material reality. I also think there's a strong possibility that we reincarnate, and that we do tend to plan the main events of our lives here (although not down to the tiniest detail) and that may include one or more "exit points".

    There is the fact that many children and young people die, and this happens every day all over the world, due to illnesses, accidents, wars, murder and so on. Without some form of direct communication, we will not know whether any one of these deaths was planned before incarnation, but I think that given the sheer number of cases throughout history the possibility is there (not in every instance, perhaps).

    I wouldn't want to dismiss the impact or the horror or heartbreak of these events. They shouldn't be trivialised or somehow pushed away from our thoughts as being "okay" when, to family members and loved ones especially, they're not okay at all - the shock, pain, grieving and sense of loss are very real.

    On the other hand, the problem is that we're experiencing all of this, and discussing it, from this side of the physical/non-physical divide. We don't have all the information. It's like holding a small two-dimensional puzzle piece and trying to fit it into a huge puzzle that exists in three or more dimensions, without being able to mentally grasp these dimensions and see where the piece might go.

    So when a young person unexpectedly dies, the general tendency is to say they have gone "before their time". And that may well be true. However, it might also be the case that they had a mission (of which we cannot know the details) and that they completed that mission, whatever it was, as planned.
    jimrich and Kurt like this.
  6. jimrich

    jimrich Active Member

    "There is indeed a genuine "I" (or a "You") that is who you truly are. It is eternal, perfect love" ~ Roberta Grimes
    This one sentence answers all of your questions in a nutshell.
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2018
    Kurt likes this.
  7. Kurt

    Kurt Well-Known Member

    Maybe there are some deaths that are meant to occur but not all of them are planned out.

    For example, I believe there was a lady who said her husband died choking on a hot dog.... I do not think that that was a destined choice....

    The timing of the death? Maybe. The details?

    I am not convinced
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2018
  8. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    Dear friends, while we are on earth our limited earth-minds think in terms of on-off switches. True/not-true. One of the things that I have deduced from all my research into the afterlife is that in the greater reality that dichotomy seems not to exist as we perceive it. There facts don't play simple three-dimensional chess, but rather they are playing chess on maybe ten dimensions. As we would see it, things in the greater reality easily are true and not-true simultaneously. I don't understand it, but I am confident now that questions like "was planned/was not planned" are irrelevant to what the truth of it would be from the perspective of our much more vast eternal minds.

    We are told, however, that sub-adult deaths - and age 20 is probably in that category - are nearly always gifts from very advanced beings who have no further need to enter bodies for their own growth, but they have made the sacrifice to enter a body and die young as a gift to loved ones, especially family members. Based on everything I have learned, my guess is that this is one more case of such a gift made in an effort to spur the spiritual growth of family members, but we would need to know a lot more about the family to be able even to hazard a guess as to why.
    Kurt likes this.
  9. mac

    mac Staff Member

    I know from what you've said before that's how you see matters, Roberta, and for me that reason is in my 'pending' mental pigeon-hole - still to be accepted. In respect of my example I'd taken that possibility as read but I should have added that option to the poll choices - my bad and I've since modified the last choice.

    But if this particular young woman hadn't planned (before her latest incarnation) to return to spirit in the way you've suggested - and you did say "....nearly always gifts from advanced beings....." (my emphasis) - then she still may have changed her mind for the reason I suggested.
    Kurt likes this.

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