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Discussion in 'Member Introductions' started by dingodile, Mar 18, 2018.

  1. dingodile

    dingodile Member

    That's correct, and in fact the standard meaning of the word is the philosophical one, which goes back over 2,000 years to Aristotle's works, although Aristotle himself didn't use the term. Some of Aristotle's writings were collected as "ta phusika", meaning "the physical ones", i.e., the writings about physical things. The ones that came next were later collected as "ta meta ta phusika", or the books after the physics books. These books dealt with things like the nature of abstract entities, such as numbers, the nature of causation, the "one-many" problem, and so on. These are still the core topics in metaphysics. The use of "metaphysics" to refer mainly to things such as spirits or subtle energies is very much a contemporary invention.

    I'd add that solidity as anything but an emergent property hasn't been a significant part of the concept of matter for a while now, although it was for some of the ancient Greek atomists.
     
  2. kim

    kim Active Member

    What exactly do you mean?
     
  3. genewardsmith

    genewardsmith Active Member

    Democritus, the ancient Greek philosopher, thought that matter was composed out of little hard, indivisible particles of varied shapes. The solidity of these particles was inherent in their nature. Now we see the apparent solidity of matter as the outcome of quantum mechanics, the Pauli exclusion principle and the electric charge of an electron in particular. So, it "emerges" from a more basic level.
     
  4. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    Dear friends, it doesn't matter when a term originated; what matters to us as we have a modern-day discussion is the way it is used now. And in 2018, I see "metaphysics" often used by many to mean a woo-woo and unreal form of physics, when in fact now the evidence strongly suggests that there is only one physics for our one reality. And that physics includes a great deal that is "metaphysical."

    The fact is that as far back as Plato and Aristotle, there was a break between "material"and "religious" as two different and incompatible modes of thinking. That break was codified early in the twentieth century when the mainstream scientific community began to enforce materialism as what they then called "the fundamental scientific dogma." And that dogma persists in universities and scientific journals to this day! It doesn't so much matter that it is materialism that they are enforcing, but the very fact that there IS a dogma is the problem. It limits what can be studied. It has turned what should be the unfettered search for the truth about reality (insofar as that truth can be discovered) into a mere belief-system. Science is now just another religion, if you will permit me to be frank: it is the religion of atheism. So, like every other religion, it is now a fly in amber, preserving a world view and a way of thinking that is now a century old.
     
  5. kim

    kim Active Member

    We are seem to be trying these days to unite the material or visible world with in invisible or spiritual world. To me, that is what the construction of the word 'conscience' signifies: a combination of the knowledge of two different realms, but one we experience physically and temporarily and the other eternally and invisibly.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2018
  6. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    I think you are right about the direction. But we are so stuck in old, dual modes of thinking that make it very difficult for us to look at things sufficiently objectively to begin to grasp what actually is going on!
     
  7. kim

    kim Active Member

    I think I understand. By dual modes, do you mean two different ways of perceiving reality? To think that there are two different states of existence is a faulty way to perceive reality, since that says there are two states of existence, or realities, when to Consciousness there is only one state of existence?
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2018
  8. RobertaGrimes

    RobertaGrimes Administrator

    Matter/spirit, right/wrong, good/evil, true/false: in fact, all such distinctions are based in limited human thinking and perceptions. Since we come to earth with access to only a limited part of our vast, eternal minds, we find it hard to wrap these teeny minds around the fact that in reality, there are no such distinctions. Even true/false. It is indeed a puzzlement!
     
    kim likes this.
  9. genewardsmith

    genewardsmith Active Member

    So you are saying it is true that there is no distinction between true and false?
     
  10. kim

    kim Active Member

    What should be noted is that it is a puzzlement. That is the point Roberta was making.
     

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