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a good death

Discussion in 'General Afterlife Discussions' started by mac, Oct 2, 2019.

  1. Ruby

    Ruby Established Member

    At the meeting we had with my son's consultant after his death she more or less said that the treatments she and her colleagues prescribe for others would not be what they'd choose for themselves, preferring minimal intervention and to let nature take it's course, unless there's a good chance of recovery. Of course, with a young person, the body is strong and can last with the symptoms not being noticed much by the person until it's too late. This is very common and many teenagers are seen for the first time in accident and emergency departments. Then they die often quite quickly in a hospice which is nice and calm on a sea of drugs. Contrast that with a case ongoing at present where a woman was asked by medical staff to persuade her elderly mother to undergo cancer treatment against her better judgement and it's not worked out at all well for the old lady, who had no desire to prolong her life. It's not the death most of us dread, but the tests and waiting and treatments. A friend of mine is undergoing all this at present and has already formally complained as the health service take the date of the start of a case from date of diagnosis, to massage tbeir figures, which was early January, but as she explained to me, she went to the doctor in September, and the whole thing has been so slow that the cancer hadn't spread at her operation a month ago, but the stage was more advanced than it would have been had they operated in good time and it's now likely to return! Very upsetting!
     
  2. Davidwright

    Davidwright New Member

    Mac, I'm a new member and would like to respond to your former posts in this forum regarding the dropoff of posts. Here is my twist regarding forums in general. Even if someone is not actively posting doesn't mean they are not looking and still learning. Also, there are all types of posters. I for one am a reader that doesn't respond much. An example of this is a forum I belonged to for many years that was composed of dentists ( I retired from the profession 3 years ago). I can't tell you how much I appreciated reading the dental posts every day ( even though I didn't post much) and the volume of information I obtained about running my practice. The same can be said about this forum. Since, I joined last week, I have been reading all over the forum . I assure you that I most likely won't post much (just due to my methods of learning)but I want you to know that you and the rest of the posters and Roberta are doing an excellent job of helping people like myself understand the afterlife. In other words, there are most likely a bunch of us out there that are mostly readers but really do appreciate the forum and people that are actively participating. So, as long as you can do it, please keep going. Thanks again.
     
    ravensgate and baob like this.
  3. Davidwright

    Davidwright New Member

    Sorry Mac, I most likely put my first post in the wrong place, just learning how things work
     
  4. mac

    mac Staff Member

    Why thank you, David, for those kind and encouraging words. :)

    It's good to learn you're enjoying things here and I hope our many other registered members who don't become involved are also enjoying what they're finding - or at least finding something helpful and/or useful.
     
    Davidwright likes this.
  5. mac

    mac Staff Member

    I wanted to come back to this subject, David, to better explain my perspective. It's one of my probably-many annoying characteristics that I feel I need to support the way I approach matters spiritual and many others come to that. Firstly I've already acknowledged the point you made concerning so-called lurkers. For me discussion forum based websites' main attractions are firstly a place to engage in conversations and secondly somewhere to find a helpful resource section.

    Thank you for the compliment concerning the website etc. It's nice to hear that it's doing what I think it should be doing.

    I understand your approach even though I'm unable to relate to it personally. For me a forum-based website is primarily a place for me to engage with others. This applies particularly to matters of the spirit, my primary focus for quite some time. But it also used to apply to a couple of medical conditions that affect me and in the earlier years of experiencing them, a time of considerable concern, I used to similarly engage and contribute on related websites. That enabled me to ask questions and offer my thoughts. However once those conditions became quiescent I found I had little to contribute and had learned all I needed to know. At that point I largely withdrew and now am just a very occasional visitor to the websites. Mine is a very different approach from your own.

    I certainly intend to try to keep doing what I'm doing presently and it's good to know this website is appreciated. :)

    As for there potentially being a bunch of mostly readers out there well I hope you're right but I would need evidence to persuade me. With a scientific and electronics background I feel I'm analytical both by nature and by training. I look for and at the data on any particular subject to see what they're saying and the only data I have concerning readers aren't compelling.

    Now if a bunch of readers were to do what you've done - write in to say similar things - then I'd have those data to go on. But, of course, as members who prefer to remain in the background they likely wouldn't write in to tell me that! :D But I do have certain data I've been monitoring for some time and they have helped me gain an overall impression of the picture. I also have many years of experience on various other, but similar, websites. On those too there appears to have been a major drop off in the number of active members although without the data to show it I might be drawing an invalid conclusion.

    None of all that is intended as criticism of anyone. It's simply the way I feel; I'm much happier when I interact, even if individuals disagree with me. At least then I feel I'm achieving something and for me as an individual that's important.
     
  6. CuriousYeti

    CuriousYeti New Member

    [QUOTE="mac, post: 61815[/QUOTE]

    Many years ago now, maybe 18 months after my dad had beat throat cancer the first time, he was re-diagnosed with it. The chemo and surgaries had left him broken, but ok. He decided not to undergo treatment the second time, and we all understood and respected his decision.

    His death was pretty bad, in hospice we said goodbye but he was already so sedated, then coma. They figured he'd be a day, maybe two, and they quit the interveinous feeding. They starved him for 10 days, I think it was a record for that hospice, he just wouldn't go.

    Thinking back now I'm wondering if there was more to that, him being there for so long. It was really hard for all of us. One of the nurses at one point had told us that perhaps he was waiting until he was alone to go so that he wouldn't traumatize any of us. That is what ended up happening. I don't think back on it as really sad, there was a lot of good that came from it.

    I remember thinking at the time that if the choice had been mine I would have fought tooth and nail for life until the last day. I still think so. If I still feel strong enough to keep going, I will. Just my two cents. :)
     
  7. Auras

    Auras New Member

    I wrote a few paragraphs on how I felt about this but removed it... since I have not known anyone who has gone through this i don’t think it’s fair for me to throw my opinions around.

    all I will say is that the one who is suffering, the power is in their hands. We now have doctors who can ease the pain to make passing more comfortable.
     
  8. mac

    mac Staff Member

    long time no see, Josh - It's nice to have you back. :)

    Why not return your original thoughts? Your contribution is as valid as any other's. Opinion is all that any of us can express as there in no right or wrong answer in this situation.
     
    Auras likes this.
  9. Auras

    Auras New Member

    Thanks, Mac. I try to pop on every now and again.

    it’s a difficult situation. I’m finding it hard to put into words. I believe family / friends who pressure the sufferer to carry on living for longer than expected are very selfish. Yes they don’t want said person to pass away, yes they’re scared, yes it hurts but at the same time the family / friends are not the one with the pain. I have no idea what it feels like, but what I do know is that you can only take something for so long until you’re tired enough and just want to be at peace.

    I believe when’s it’s your time to pass, you will pass. Extending your life by what? Days? Weeks? Months? Year? Is only going to make the pain worse.
     
  10. mac

    mac Staff Member

    .....nnnnn
    I feel very similar to you, Josh. We're hard-wired to behave in many ways and our feelings about someone dying is an important one. As humans we fear death, we dread losing a loved one; we know no reason to feel any different. As spiritual seekers it puts us in a different and often difficult position. We know there's nothing to fear in death yet many of us still fear it. Hard-wired emotion often overrides updated 'firmware'!

    I happen to be re-reading some of Silver Birch's teachings. I've been greatly impressed by his words but now at nearly 73 I'm 'hearing' them differently. I'm finding myself questioning his manner, something I wouldn't have dreamed of doing years ago when I began my search for understanding. But I'm old now and see and feel things differently from how I used to do. Silver Birch is older than any of us and doubtless sees things differently from how he used to when he was still incarnating in this world.

    I'm less inclined to be persuaded by certain of SB's ideas than I once was and I find I'm questioning others ideas too. ;)
     

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