Apparently science is going to explain it all to those who believe in a higher power!

[Matty Mo]

http://news.yahoo.com/science-someda...115945479.html

Excerpts from article - "Sean Carroll, a theoretical cosmologist at the California Institute of Technology, says there's good reason to think science will ultimately arrive at a complete understanding of the universe that leaves no grounds for God whatsoever. He thinks the sphere of supernatural influence will eventually shrink to nil."

"But there are other potential grounds for God. Physicists have observed that many of the physical constants that define our universe, from the mass of the electron to the density of dark energy, are eerily perfect for supporting life. Alter one of these constants by a hair, and the universe becomes unrecognizable."

I'm not sure why this bothers me so much, I think I am just not a fan of the pseudo intellectual superiority that seems to come through in articles like this. I'm not anti-science, I personally think it's a wonderful aspect of our lives. What bothers me is how only some science is deemed worthy of explaining our existence. Near death studies, astral projections studies, remote viewing, and the likes? All balderdash, of course!

To me, it seems the more questions Science answers the more questions that come about. Seems pretty arrogant of any scientist(s) to try and claim they'll have all the answers soon.

[BruceAdama]

I just hate the arrogance of the scientific community. Supposedly, human science thinks it's in a position to answer the question of God, when we as a species haven't even gone farther than our own Moon. Yeah... right. If an alien race saw this arrogance, they'd laugh themselves to death at our own stupidity, and I'd laugh right along with them. Stephen Hawking lost any and all legitimacy as a scientist when he claimed there is no God. I was like "Really, Stephen... wow... I didn't know you died.". I can't stand that level of arrogant smugness. Mr. Hawking can't figure out how to break the light barrier, but of course he knows for a fact that God doesn't exist. Riiiiight...

[Roberta Grimes]

Heh - I can understand your frustration with all this scientific smugness, dear friends, because for years I would grind my teeth in frustration whenever I came across that sort of article! It felt like being in a race, and losing because the other side (simultaneously arrogant and clueless) had an unfair advantage. It was outrageous! But the more I studied the afterlife evidence in the light of quantum physics, and the more I read about the history of mainstream science over the past hundred years, the more ridiculous all these scientists came to seem to me. We know the truth now. There is no contest at all. They can pontificate and posture and make stupid claims to primacy for their ideas as much as they like, but that does not change reality. They are pathetic, really, and now I see them that way. The older ones (like Hawking) have been backing the wrong theories for their entire careers, and the smarter ones among them are dimly seeing that now (which is why they are protesting all the more desperately - as if insisting that their theories are right will somehow make them a little more true). The duller ones are like fish, so immersed in water that the very concept of wetness eludes them. Don't let these fools bother you, dear friends. The truth is the truth. And sooner or later, truth wins!

[Matty Mo]

Don't let these fools bother you, dear friends. The truth is the truth. And sooner or later, truth wins!

I would love to believe you, Roberta, and as always love your insights. However, I've seen too often, in just my short few years of being on this planet, where a subset of people lay claim to what is the absolute truth, primarily religions and scientists. Anyone with beliefs outside what is proselytized or what is stated as infallible fact are seemingly ignored. It saddens me that people either seem castigated and/or ignored by religious zealots or treated as an imbecile if they question some scientific theories. Society as a whole, seems so unenlightened at times.

However, as the great Roger Waters once sang, "Oh, oh, oh, the tide is turning." I want to believe that there are many more people in our society that are growing tired of being told all the answers are either explained via full faith in religion or trusting a subset of scientists that claim they have, or will have, all the answers for us. I think most of us know that the true answers lie somewhere in between and I think people are getting that. A lot of those wonderful people are right here on this site.

It's always refreshing to hear from people like yourself who've studied so much and dealt with so many negative aspects of people questioning your beliefs. I take more stock in people who have studied things from all angles instead of prescribing to one aspect and hanging on for dear life.

I just hate the arrogance of the scientific community. Supposedly, human science thinks it's in a position to answer the question of God, when we as a species haven't even gone farther than our own Moon. Yeah... right. If an alien race saw this arrogance, they'd laugh themselves to death at our own stupidity, and I'd laugh right along with them. Stephen Hawking lost any and all legitimacy as a scientist when he claimed there is no God. I was like "Really, Stephen... wow... I didn't know you died.". I can't stand that level of arrogant smugness. Mr. Hawking can't figure out how to break the light barrier, but of course he knows for a fact that God doesn't exist. Riiiiight...

I believe Stephen Hawking's book was simply produced to rile people up and sell books. I have no problem with him presenting his insight into the conversation. I do, however, have issues with people trying to make their assertions sound like absolute truth. There are many people who worship Hawking's beliefs as the truth and if you question it then they look at you like you're the village idiot.

When you ask how are die hard skeptics/atheists any better than religious zealots, they'll inevitably tell you that they are better because they think logically whereas religious people deal strictly in faith. Well, to me this life we live is as Spock would say, "highly illogical." So to try and wrap it all up for me in a little box and say, here's all the answers I would have to say, you're gonna need a much bigger box than this.

[mac]

Maybe I'm just lucky, maybe it's because I've just emerged from my 'Mr Angry' time of life or maybe it's just my age (65) that leaves me in a couldn't-care-less frame of mind about all such matters.....

I'm uninterested in the babble from all the individuals - scientists or whatever - and claims that something is, or isn't, 'the truth'. Folk may claim all they wish as 'the truth' but that changes nothing - the truth is simply 'that which is true' and no amount of conjecture, personal belief or hypotheses can alter it.

My expectation is that there's little chance of humankind generally getting much further forward with understanding all this 'stuff' in the next few decades, certainly not before I kick the bucket! I also expect our spiritual awareness, understanding and progression will be gradual and on an individual basis well into whatever future humankind has. No amazing revelations, no science, no Messiah or prophet to show the way.....

Maybe by the time I've crossed over and come back, things generally will have moved on somewhat; but I likely won't register the changes any more than I can register any changes this time around!

Or maybe I am seeing those very changes and that's why I feel the way I described in my opening sentence......?

[Matty Mo]

Maybe I'm just lucky, maybe it's because I've just emerged from my 'Mr Angry' time of life or maybe it's just my age (65) that leaves me in a couldn't-care-less frame of mind about all such matters.....

I'm uninterested in the babble from all the individuals - scientists or whatever - and claims that something is, or isn't, 'the truth'. Folk may claim all they wish as 'the truth' but that changes nothing - the truth is simply 'that which is true' and no amount of conjecture, personal belief or hypotheses can alter it.

My expectation is that there's little chance of humankind generally getting much further forward with understanding all this 'stuff' in the next few decades, certainly not before I kick the bucket! I also expect our spiritual awareness, understanding and progression will be gradual and on an individual basis well into whatever future humankind has. No amazing revelations, no science, no Messiah or prophet to show the way.....

Maybe by the time I've crossed over and come back, things generally will have moved on somewhat; but I likely won't register the changes any more than I can register any changes this time around!

Or maybe I am seeing those very changes and that's why I feel the way I described in my opening sentence......?

Well put, Mac. I will say my "angry, lash out at the world" days are mostly past me. From time to time I do let something get me a tad rankled, like stories such as this. I hope some day to be as seemingly at peace as you are, I'm only 40 so I have a few years to catch up right?

[mac]

Well put, Mac. I will say my "angry, lash out at the world" days are mostly past me. From time to time I do let something get me a tad rankled, like stories such as this. I hope some day to be as seemingly at peace as you are, I'm only 40 so I have a few years to catch up right?

At 40 I was still pretty obstreperous..... I've mellowed a little since.

It was also only a few years into my 'awakening' and I had almost evangelical zeal. I must have been insufferable and in them, thar days there was nowhere to express myself as I can nowadays via forums. It had to be 'Letters to the Editor' to get one's views into the public eye.

Now it's easy to rant in public in so many ways - and folk are doing just that, often with little sensible to say and using poor language skills. And nowI'm off on my currently-favorite hobby-horse!

[BruceAdama]

It bugs me because people give these pathetic excuses for scientists a free pass. Science is all about FACT. Cold, hard, unequivocal, fact. And the FACT is, that Stephen Hawking didn't die... he's still alive, nor did he have an NDE, so far as we know. Thus, he is not in a position of any scientific authority to offer a "definitive" opinion on the issue of God, and to do so on the mantle of science discredits him, since he's not speaking from cold, hard, scientific fact and direct observation... he's speaking from his own opinion, and quite frankly, out of his butthole. But because he's so respected, people give him a pass, and go along with anything he says. These are the minds that are teaching our children... what does that say then, if the most respected scientists don't even adhere to their own scientific methods of observation, research, and conclusion?

[mac]

chill...........

[Roberta Grimes]

It bugs me because people give these pathetic excuses for scientists a free pass. Science is all about FACT. Cold, hard, unequivocal, fact. And the FACT is, that Stephen Hawking didn't die... he's still alive, nor did he have an NDE, so far as we know. Thus, he is not in a position of any scientific authority to offer a "definitive" opinion on the issue of God, and to do so on the mantle of science discredits him, since he's not speaking from cold, hard, scientific fact and direct observation... he's speaking from his own opinion, and quite frankly, out of his butthole. But because he's so respected, people give him a pass, and go along with anything he says. These are the minds that are teaching our children... what does that say then, if the most respected scientists don't even adhere to their own scientific methods of observation, research, and conclusion?

I really love your zeal, dear friend! But this effort to bring the truth to all humanity is a marathon, not a sprint. Like our beloved Mac, I am in my mid-sixties, and I agree with him that age does seem to soften our reactions to things that in our youth would have seemed intolerable. Ironic, isn't it, that when we are young we tend to be impatient, even though we can see lots of time ahead; but when we are old, and time here is shortening, so many things seem to matter less and less...?